Feb 3, 2014; Salt Lake City, UT, USA; Toronto Raptors small forward Terrence Ross (31) controls the ball during the first quarter against the Utah Jazz at EnergySolutions Arena. Mandatory Credit: Russ Isabella-USA TODAY Sports

NBA Trade Proposals: Push For A Deep Raptors Playoff Run

Jan 31, 2014; Denver, CO, USA; Denver Nuggets forward Kenneth Faried (35) with the ball during the first half against the Toronto Raptors at Pepsi Center. Mandatory Credit: Chris Humphreys-USA TODAY Sports

With Kyle Lowry rumored to be off the trading block, I have two trades to offer.  The suggested trades have been approved by the NBA Trade Machine, and are both independent thoughts on the Toronto Raptors options.

The first trade involves the Raptors and Denver Nuggets.  The Nuggets seem willing to take offers for Kenneth Faried, according to David Aldridge who was interviewed here prior to the All-Star game.  The Raptors would send Denver Terrence Ross, Greivis Vasquez and Steve Novak for Kenneth Faried, Andre Miller and Jordan Hamilton.  This gives Toronto more strength and physicality from the starting Power Forward spot, and an experienced leader as a backup point guard to Kyle Lowry.  The Nuggets get a young Ross, full of potential to start at the Small Forward, moving Wilson Chandler to the Power Forward spot, a backup point guard they sorely need in Greivis Vasquez, and some outside shooting in Steve Novak.

The second trade that would need to be made to replace the loss of Terrence Ross is with the Atlanta Hawks.  This trade sends Amir Johnson to Atlanta for Kyle Korver.  This gives the Raptors one of the best outside shooting threats in the NBA, gives Atlanta more size, and someone who can start at the Centre position during Al Horford’s recovery.  To replace Korver, Atlanta have Demarre Carroll who has been playing well enough to earn a starting position. The loss of Korver can be mitigated for more size.  The Raptors will then have a starting lineup of Jonas Valanciunas, DeMar DeRozan, Faried,  Korver and Lowry.  The bench rotation would likely be Chuck Hayes or Tyler Hansbrough, Patrick Patterson, John Salmons, and Miller.  This would build the Raptors for a playoff push, but could all quickly crumble in the off-season if Lowry is unwilling to resign (or the Raptors are unable to resign him at an amount that is reasonable).  The move is also risky due to Korver’s age (32) with 4 years on his contract.

Verdict:  I believe that all teams win with these trades, in fact Denver might be getting too much in this deal.  The Hawks improve up front, while the Raptors round out their squad, filling in the holes lost from the Nuggets trade.

Likelihood:  25%.  We are talking some pretty big if’s here, getting both teams involved to agree to these trades.  I think Denver is more likely to agree than the Hawks, but stranger things have happened during the NBA Trade Deadline.

WWMD [What Would Masai Ujiri Do?]:  I think if these trades are both available Masai Ujiri will pull the trigger on them, however he might try to insist on a first round draft pick instead of Jordan Hamilton.

What do you think Raptors Rapture, have I lost my mind?  Do you think I’m making sense?  I’d like to hear your thoughts.

Greg Hall is a Staff Writer for Raptors Rapture.

Tags: Atlanta Hawks Denver Nuggets Toronto Raptors

  • Jensan

    Denver wants to get rid of miller , and know that PF is a large problem

  • Jensan

    Patterson and Novak for Fareid and Miller. Miller could be traded for Jordan hill and or Jody Meeks or to Dallas.

    • Darius

      Keep dreamin’

      • Jensan

        Darius, sure your coach wants Miller back, my personal offer was Amir Johnson plus our first for Miller and Faried. Miller is not my cup of tea either, but for Faried, I would throw in the first….

    • Greg Hall

      I would politely say no to this option as well. As much as I want Faried for his defensive presence, I like Patrick Patterson for the same reason. Both are very good at help and recover defense (something Amir Johnson struggles with at his size and quickness). Right now the two biggest problems are being pushed around too much inside by opposing bigs, and too slow a rotation after help, and Patterson is our best at the second (unless we get Faried). Thanks for your thoughts.

  • Guest

    No thanks to Korver. We do not need a hole on defence, which is what these trades would create. For Faried’s offensive skills, I’m also not sure about his defence. The Raps are winning because of their D, and I think these trades would hurt them.

    • Greg Hall

      Thank you Guest, for your comment, although I disagree with you profoundly. Faried is primarily a defensive specialist who is still a bit raw on the offensive end, but he is getting better there. Korver while certainly not going to win any defensive player of the year honors has done a good job guarding DeRozan and is better than most give him credit for, but I do understand your concern, he is not as good defensively as say, John Salmons. I believe the addition of Faried inside would help mask that weakness.

      • Guest

        How do you define “defensive specialist”?

        • Greg Hall

          As far as the advanced analytics go you are going to be beyond my expertise there, I’m more of a watch and evaluate kind of mind. Faried is a paint protector and rim presence, he plays a very physical kind of game to try to push around guys like Blake Griffin and DeMarcus Cousins. Right now the Raptors have no one who can do that (it should be JV’s assignment, but he’s still too raw). Faried can do that, and has been more known for his paint protection than his offence. Is he a perfect defender, well no, he’s no #1 all defensive team guy, but from what I’ve seen he’s fundamentally sound, with lots of energy, effort, and willingness to learn, that is all I’m basing my decision on.

          I appreciate your comments, and from an analytic side you are probably dead on the money. My argument with analytics is the Memphis Grizzles (please see their transformation over the past year, they have changed their team based on purely analytic decisions). Personally I don’t like where that has lead the Memphis Grizzlies. It is great to have analytics to fall back on, but sometimes you just have to trust your gut and your what your eyes are telling you in my opinion. I personally have liked how team chemistry has helped the Raptors climb to a playoff position by the All-Star weekend, and you certainly won’t find team chemistry anywhere in analytics either.

          I will concede that perhaps Faried is not the perfect fix for the Raptors current situation, I would be curious if you have any suggestions for who the Raptors should target for the trade deadline.

          Thanks again for your comments and the analytical data to point out any flaws in my logic, I like being kept on my toes :)

          • Guest

            Your openness to comments in response to your article is admirable. Thank you.

          • Greg Hall

            My pleasure, I’m glad you commented. Perhaps we will hear more from you in the future.

      • Guest

        Here is one for you, then. Faried’s team is a net -0.6 when he is on the floor. His team actually gives up 1.1 more points per 100 possessions when he is on the floor than when he is not. The effective field goal % of the other team actually goes up 2.1% when he is on the floor.
        Amir Johnson? The raps give up 7.3 points less per 100 possessions when he is on the floor.
        These are 2012/2013 stats, and they aren’t perfect. But I’d like to know on what basis Faried is a “defensive specialist”.
        Manimal, maybe, but I don’t want to pay for a great nickname.

  • Jensan

    How about trading for Jeff Green instead there is a starting Small Forward, and you can send John Salmons plus this years 1st to make it work. So Celtic can dump a salary of approx. $7 million next year.

    Allows Terrence Ross, to mature for the year. Than you have a Starting Lineup of
    Lowry, Derozan, Green, Amir Johnson and JV, with Vasquez, Ross,Novak, Patterson, Hansborough. and resign Lowry for next year. Donate Landry Fields and Chuck Hayes (at least provides an effort) to a charity of your choice.

    • Greg Hall

      Hello Jensan thanks for you comment, this does not address our biggest issue right now which is physicality and size inside the paint, Faried provides this. I am also very unimpressed with Jeff Green, I’m not sure that would work out for the Raptors.

      • Jensan

        Greg , please i am old school which eubonics class were you taking for the word physicality. This is known as a colloquialism. If you wish to have a physical presence, than Faried may do the trick, however, I still would offer Amir plus a first for Faried and Miller.

        • Greg Hall

          I have looked up colloquialism in the merriam-webster dictionary and I can assure you it is not a local redneck term (Please note the cowboy hat in my profile pic) . I looked up physicality in the merriam-webster dictionary online (I cannot link or my post will be rejected) and still believe this word is the one I want. Physicality is also used by NBA announcers collectively, and quite frequently too. I’m sorry you are unfamiliar with it’s use, but I can assure you it is not eubonics. Thanks again for your comments

          • Jensan

            Just because NBA announcers and NFL announcers use Physicality as a word, this does not make it correct. Go ask a linguistics professor, not a dictionary, my frustration is a rationalization for using one made up word instead of a phrase as the physical ability or physical nature. Just outright expediency on the parts of the announcer. The phrase that you may have heard before ” if you say it enough times it must be the truth”. Greg you need the truth is the Emperor wears no clothes.

            Now back to basketball rosterbation , see I can blasphemies the English Language as well.

  • TM

    Greg, I definitely applaud the creativity and checking against the cap ramifications, but I personally would not want to see this done nor do I think it a realistic consideration. Allow me to explain. You tout Faried as a more physical presence and rim protector, and the center piece to why Toronto would make this deal (though you also make a fair point that Andre Miller could come in and run the 2nd unit and be a respectable floor general), but I fail to see how he presents a different athletic profile than Amir Johnson. Both are energy 4 types who thrive on rebounding the basketball and playing pesky defence. Faried rebounds at a slightly higher rate, but he is no better a rim protector than Amir is (his block totals, or lack thereof, support this fact) and the drop off in offensive skill set is simply not worth the additional board or two he’d snatch per game. Faried can’t bang with the legitimate centers in the league any better than Johnson can, which makes this a rather lateral move defensively, rather than upgrade in my opinion. Furthermore Amir has developed a solid mid range game (and even the early signs of reliable 3 point range) that allows him to space the floor and is invaluable to overall team offense. I think his moving to the bench has more to do with Patrick Patterson being a good fit next to J-Val (a jump shooting 4 next to a paint clogging pivot at 5) and the versatility that Johnson provides in that he can play center alongside either Patterson or Hansborough and provide some length to bother would be penetrators. You can’t play Patterson and Hansborough together for long stretches since you’d have no shot blocking, so better to switch up the rotation and have Amir come off the bench to ensure one of him or Jonas is on the floor.

    Don’t get me wrong, I like Faried as a player, I think he is the type of guy that makes for winning teams (I wouldn’t read too much into the analytics, since he plays for a team where nearly every player is allergic to defense, I don’t think you will find many combinations of players who are net positives in +/- on Denver) given he doesn’t need the ball to affect the game. I do however think I’d rather have Amir and Ross than Faried and Korver given the defensive drop off we’d see. Sure, Korver is an elite shooter, but Ross is knocking down 3′s at 40% on the year so I’m not convinced Korver’s sharp shooting is going to improve our offense enough to justify the drop off in defence. Moving Novak’s contract would be blessing, but I also think I’d rather maintain flexibility and keep Vasquez and his cheaper player option than pay Andre Miller nearly 5 next year. Not to mention, Vasquez is a year removed from dropping 9 dimes a game as a starter. I think you can still pitch that in trades, and he could still turn his game around considering he’s had to make so many adjustments having been traded twice in one year.

    I do agree with the notion we need to get a bit more physical in the paint, and the move I’d really like to see is us trading for Chris Kaman. A legit 5 who can tangle with Indiana and give Miami some match up issues, his only issue is health but we could manage his minutes off the bench and plug him in when Jonas has his off nights. He’s an expiring deal too, so no harm done to our long term cap. I think I’m dreaming when I say this, but I wonder if LA would take back Hansborough and a 2nd rounder for that contract? Psycho-T is only signed on for next season and even if they don’t have room for him in their rotation (which they may if they lose Gasol or Hill) they can peddle him in a deal as a useful expiring contract. I doubt they would consider Novak because he has 2 years remaining after this one. Thoughts?

    • Greg Hall

      I certainly agree that Faried is too undersized to make a significant impact on the bigger Center’s in the league (Hibbert for example). I am pleasantly surprised to see someone with a similar thought to the Patrick Patterson and Amir Johnson situation as I am as I temporarily shelved a post regarding this situation which I will likely be publishing soon, please check back and comment on that when it’s published.

      As far as a legit Center, I was wanting to avoid any deals related to one as this would like diminish JV’s playing time, especially in the playoffs, but I have to admit that it will likely be a move the Raptors will have to make to have any chance at beating Indiana or Miami in a playoff series. I’ve always liked Chris Kaman, but upon further reflection a guy like Omer Asik might be a nice target (if it weren’t for his contract) as he will likely come cheap (no pun intended). Asik has not played and seems unwilling to play for the Rockets so moving him, almost at all costs would seem to be a priority for Houston, they might even take back some big contracts like Chuck Hayes and Landry Fields.

      The Trade Deadline is only 2 hours away, and I have not checked any moves that may have been made today so I will part with this; I will be watching the sporting news with an anxious eye as the deals unfold today, for the Raptors and their rivals.

  • mweichert

    I would have loved these trades to have occurred.

    • Greg Hall

      This certainly would have created a lot of excitement (and possibly a little resentment from trading Amir Johnson). A guy like Faried would be very intriguing on this team I think. Thanks for your comments